If you’re the average 12 year old skateboarder you probably aren’t too concerned about the controversy in the skateboarding industry over skateboard decks that are made in China. You might not even know which companies are already manufacturing their decks there, such as Dwindle.
But if you’re over 15 you might have heard about it and your main concern probably has to do with quality. “Chinese boards break easier” or “Chinese boards delaminate too fast” are things you might have heard others say.
And if you’re over 20 you might have some US pride and don’t want to see yet another product being made overseas. Maybe some people around you are talking about how this is putting some US companies out of business and their workers out of jobs.
Before we go any farther, you might want to read China – Whether We Like it or Not by Jeff Harbaugh. I’m not sure anyone understands what’s going on in the skateboarding industry as well as Jeff does. Even though this article was written in 2002 it is still quite relevant. In fact, it’s dead-on.
One of the main points Jeff brings up is that if the price of making a deck in China and shipping it to the US is substantially lower than making it in the US and quality is the only issue, then someone is going to figure out how to make a quality board in China and get it to the US. Then the question becomes whether or not people will buy it, all other things being equal. So let me ask you the question by presenting a scenario.
You break your deck. You can’t skate until you get a new one. You go to the shop and they’ve got two decks left. One is from your favorite company that happens to make decks in the US, but it’s $50 with grip. The other deck is made by a company that isn’t your favorite company, but they’re not that bad. But they get their decks from China. Their deck with grip is $40. You’ve got $45 in your pocket. You stand on the decks and they feel identical. What are you going to do?
Let’s add some complications to it. Your friends are going skating tonight, and you can’t earn another $5 until tomorrow. On top of that, one of your friends has a deck from this company that makes them in China and he hasn’t complained about it any more than he does about any other deck he’s ever had. Plus if you get the cheaper deck you can walk away with $5 in your pocket.
I’d say that chances are you’re going to walk away with the cheaper deck. And if you could somehow look into a crystal ball and know that the quality is equal and the shapes are identical, there’s about a 100% chance you’re going to get it.
What about blanks? It’s the same question. What if you could get a US blank for $30 with grip, but you can get a Chinese made one with grip for $20? When you take away the effect of branding on the decision, it becomes even more obvious that China decks are going to win out–assuming the quality factor is taken care of. That’s the big question, of course.
Am I happy about this? Well, not particularly. All things being equal, I would rather buy products made in my own country. And I have some concerns about China’s human rights violations and their use of slave labor (using prisoners, in this case, many of whom are in prison for political reasons, such as wanting the freedom to simply go to church or simply say what they want to in public).
You could get into a debate about whether buying products from China perpetuates the human rights problems or is indirectly leading to more freedoms. Perhaps the best way to fix China is to turn them from communists to capitalists. You can’t argue convincingly that capitalist countries don’t take better care of their people and the environment than China or the former USSR have.
But the point is that no matter what I think, kids are ultimately going to buy the cheap decks. Everything else is already made in Asia from shoes to your skate tool. If I don’t carry the China decks in my shop, somebody else will and I’ll go out of business. If the companies having their decks made in the US don’t start making their decks in China they’ll probably go out of business too, no matter how good their team is or how good their branding is. Price is the ultimate weapon in business and has the power to trump everything else.
But I’m just one guy with limited knowledge of all this stuff. What do you think?
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I read Mr. Harbaugh’s article, just so I myself would have a better understanding of the scenario. I think its important for people to understand the industry and markets so that they are better informed consumers. To bad this is how it works. Hopefully the global economy will demand more and maybe the United States will regain a more favorable place in the competitive manufacturing process.
I honestly think china makes the best decks. When i ride their boards i feel like i get more out of how much i pay for the deck. No matter if its a blank, checker board deck, enjoi, or world industries deck china made boards are great.
I agree…..im all up for competition & good market rates. I wonder when a chinese company will take up some slack on the quality of decks coming out of there…….watch out US when that happens!
I still support British and US manufacturers…..but i remember when i was younger the canadian boardmakers took alot of my pocketmoney aswell
Anyone interested in some cool skate pics check here:
http://www.pixelfactor.org/?p=196
And if your ever in london and would like your own skate shoot for your company or team, just look us up!
http://www.boxedlab.com
well i will buy usa cause i do not want to see our companies go out of businsess…. owned
well i had 2 mini logos that sucked the big one and snapped ina month…thats only one moth paying 60 bucks….im only 14 but i skate some big stuff…..ive been wondering hey yes thier are boards being made in us and they r gonna be a lot better with stronger wood and the chinese decks suck…..but ppl know that the decks are all gonna be about 50 bucks and if more ppl know which decks are stronger and research and find out they may look into that deck and try it out so yeah i agree with u totally
where can I find a list of the companies (or brands) which make decks in china?
martian …
look no further then the wall of your local skateshop.
The fact of the matter is the industry isnt worried about their precious pros, they have 4 letters right out of 7, PROFITS is their concern !
Profit margin is what drives the industry to be so protective and offer so many excuses why you shouldnt buy a Blank deck. fact is everybody’s over there in China. The ones that are the most voiced in objection – are the ones that have the most to loose. You want to see crazyiness? The quality is 100% THERE now, pro level man. All the big boys are there and ya know what? its all high high quality wood. No delams or breakage anymore.
If you want the real truth look no further then the very same people that are protecting their brand and crying about blanks spoiling this or spoiling that. The only thing they are going to spoil is the ridiculous b.s. It will expose the real outrageous profit margins that board companies are able to make in today’s “pro deck” market.
Martian you want a list? You dont need one, its on the wall at your local shop. Preserve the culture and the reason – big business disguised as your friendly cartoon on the bottom of your deck may be lying to you.
All the big companies that are crying are full of $%#! They outsource a ton of their work load to china. China is now making 7 ply Canadian maple decks that are superb and cheap.. The mark up on a deck is insane. I don’t know how anyone gets suckered into thinking that the companies may lose money if they lower prices. If they sold the deck for $15 to the store that’s 300% profit and then the store sold it for $30 that’s 100% for the store. I’m talking with full graphics here too! So there’s the break down for ya. Now I know that a big company has alot of people to pay but come on! It’s $5 to make a deck!!! $5!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I wanted and asìked for a list so to avoid buying a “Made in china” deck.
For istance: does sant cruz also make its decks there?
Which brands are there? If they are all there I’ll buy simpy the cheaper, blank or not.
Black Label or Foundation (both made in the USA) , Cost the same as a Flip or Element (Both made in China). USA dollar , worth less and less.. fuel up in price . guess why? Time to keep our money home. Americans do not seem to have a clue, why these things happen. American board companies are still strong ..Foundation , toy machine , black label , powell , bacon . Independet , venture , tracker and Thunder trucks all made in California. When has China ever made anything good? Corporate runs the White house . Depression is on are list. USA made decks rule.
I dont relly like to buy decks made in China, but if i had yo i would
Were are chocolate skateboards made?
China is just @#$@… No Regulations,
Its not a US thing I’ve bought boards made in the UK, Canada and wheels from Australia.. These are true skate companys… Not a profit driven outsourcing there boards to a #@!$# hole toy company in china…
I can go on the net right now and buy 20-30 blanks for 6-8 bucks a pop go down to the local skate park and sell them for $20-25 bucks..
would do no, but I’ve seen it happen…
FYI, the Bootleg name brand boards are here its not a problem yet but it will be soon…
why should we feel sorry for any company in the US or not. they can bring the price down. their not in the business for charity so they get no charity from me.
are we supposed to solve the ecomony by the boards we buy. If buying US made boards would lead to more parks or a better local skate scene I would stay with US made boards.
I buy decks in bulk on ebay for about 17 bucks with grip and their pretty #$#$# good decks. I sell um for twenty and a kid gets to skate that normally would not ,because we don’t even have a skate shop, thus china wood is making our skate scene better.
I would rather walk than skate a chinese deck. It all comes down to this – our forfathers died for our freedom – died…!!! get it – that is a huge sacrifice to believe in something so much you will die for it. But History aside – also when you buy something that is made in china (or mexico or india or viet nam) you are selling out your brother, your neighbor, and your childrens future. Without manufacturing jobs you are left with corporate jobs and service industry jobs (government jobs included). So what the hell – go ahead buy made in china. History always repeats itself – the wheel that goes around comes around – the Roman empire fell – and the USA is on a downward slide unless we learn to put our money where our mouth is – learn to sacrifice – if you can’t find it made in the USA – try to do with out. I’m not asking you to make the ultimate sacrifice – but we need to learn to sacrifice now or suffer later. Skate or Die? God Bless America
i live in thailand. skateboards are three times what they cost in america and are probably knock offs. i am looking to import a lot of uncut decks from america. would you buy qualit american product from quality thai artists??????????????????
not for every day skating but for the prom and fancy events. would you pay more for something unique and special………..or should i just buy from china and sell to the thais?
cya
danny
one of my major concerns is the extra carbon footprint involved with shipping canadian maple to china to be pressed by wage slaves then shipped back to the us! plus china has been killng and oppressing the peaceful tibetans so @#$# china!
Skateboards are awsome when i read this i bought a skateboard from china i wonder why all the skateboard shops cost alot more then china i know alot of tricks i can do with skateboard
made in the U.S. decks are toy machine, foundation, real, krooked,anti hero, dgk, organika, expedition one, listen, bueno, girl, chocolate, creature, creation, city,and theres a few more
i looked at a black label yesterday and it said made in PBR(peoples republic of china)
One reason why I will be looking for stuff made in the United States is that alot of stuff that was once alright, like Vans shoes, has become increasingly defective since it has been made in China. When a company starts making its products overseas to obtain cheaper labor, the quality of its products goes downhill while the price of its products turned junk actually remains the same. A long time ago, when Vans shoes were made in the United States, they lasted longer and were far more comfortable than this sweatshop made crap that’s part of some new mass marketing scheme. It’s too bad those quality shoes are now a memory.
In Portland, Oregon there is a local company called Rebel Skates that manufactures its decks right here in Oregon. I’ll deffinately feel better about supporting them rather than some company who sells defective made in a sweatshop crap that’s being passed off as a skateboard deck.
i know this is an old post to be replying to but:
to #9, Santa Cruz is a skateboard company out of Santa Cruz, CA. same distribution as indy trucks, krux trucks, creature decks, and a few others. they’re a U.S. company.
to #19, Black Label is hit and miss, they went thru a period of making their decks in china, but everyone complained and so they started making them in the u.s. again. if they are back to the chinese wood that’s lame, but every black label i’ve had (and they’re my favorite, so i’ve had a lot of them) says “made in the u.s.a.” on top, including the one i am currently skating (got it maybe a 2 months ago).
it is very sad about the slave labor and all that, but the economy just sucks ass right now and no one wants to pay americans real money to make something when they can give some little kid in china $0.02 an hour to do the same job. it’s kinda like if you’re a white dude living close to the mexican border, good luck finding a job down there…ask me how i know. peace
black label is chinese made again, as is creature. it is all profit driven and quality went out the window years ago. when you can no longer find a job here in the usa, thank a corporation.
I’ve been looking for USA based PS Stix woodshop decks (Alien WOrkshop, Habitat, Black Label, Old Stereo) as its all I ride due to the high quality of them, but it is practically impossible to find them now as all those Companies are now using Mexico or China.
The shapes might be the same but the concave & kick are pressed differently & the wood doesnt have the same pop as it used to have. I bought a Black Label the other day & yes it had PRC branded on the top. My heart sank to think that they’ve gonw over to China & it looks as tho I’ll never find those super high quality decks I iused to love.
To Robert:
What Black Label deck are you riding that has USA on the top? Just wondering so I can keep my eye out for that range in future. Also which ones have you had that had USA on the top. Can you name them for me? Thanks
I am convinced that the quality of a lot of stuff that was once good has gone downhill after certain companies decided to have their goods manufactured overseas. I am now personally looking for more stuff that is made in the United States alot more. Rebel Skates in Portland, Oregon is worthy of support as is Beer City from Milwaukee, Wisconsin. Check out this statement from Beer City concerning skateboard decks made in China.
http://www.beercity.com/html/madeintheusa.html
The thing to do is find the decks that are made in the United States that one likes the best. I’d much rather support those companies.
Youre right Kount Jizznack I dont care what anyone says the quality has turned to crap since Co’s decided that their profits were more important than the customers that kept them in business. If you think its the same then I’m afraid you dont know much about how good skateboards quality used to be. Maybe you arent old enough to know true quality.
There is no excuse to say that they’re cheaper because altho deck prices did drop lower (but only due to Companies info being leaked showing them to be producing in China) they have since increased to what is basically the same price we used to pay for the same USA made deck.
Dwindle get the blame for beginning of the end of quality decks, but I’m sure even Element were outsourcing their production to China at around the same time. I say this due to experience. I rode nothing but Element dekcs up until 2001 (when they suddenly disbanded from Giant Distribution) & then suddenly their featherlight decks changed. They felt different, & when you’ve ridden the same Co’s dekcs for as long as I did then you know when something feels wrong. I never rode another Element again, but was still looking for that quality they once had.
I found that quality with Stereo & Popwar, but then they left Giant & Stereo’s new boards felt heavy & soft. Then I found out that it was PS Stix Woodshop that was producing the quality pop, shape, wood & pressing that I loved so much, but unfortunatley it looks as tho PS Stix Woodshop is now based in Mexico & China.
Spotted this as I’m trying to find out more info on the whole subject, & also trying to find out which Co’s are still manufacturing in the good ol US of A.:
http://www.omnisk8.com.au/china_made.html
I found a lot of it to be pointless info on things which only an idiot wouldnt know. Also felt it was very bias but thats not surprising considering he’s moved his production to China.
One of my favorite old school decks, the Ray Underhill one with the cross and the chain, got re-issued by Powell-Peralta. Upon investigating Powell-Peralta, it seems that the Powell decks are still made in the U.S., but they have another line of decks known as “Golden Dragon” that are made in China. The Golden Dragon decks are undoubdedly sub-standard, but they are making these decks out to be somehow “perfect for beginners”. ???????????????
When I first started skating many years ago, my first deck was the Craig Johnson, Alva deck. I’ve always though that beginners should start out on the kind of decks that advanced skaters use, by that I mean ones that aren’t substandard cheap crap. That way, one becomes used to a real skateboard, instead of some junk that falls apart the first time one starts learning tricks. One would have an easier time learning on a deck that works better rather than one from China that doesn’t work right. I would think that trying to learn how to skate on a substandard deck would be more of a pain in the ass. Kind of like trying to learn how to ride a bike when the bike that one is trying to learn on doesn’t even work right. That makes learning all the more difficult. When one first starts skating, one should start out on a real deck that is quality, and made in the U.S., not some cheap schwag. Thankfully, Tony Alva is still having his decks made in the U.S.
Speaking of substandard cheap crap, remember how bad Variflex and Nash were? I would say that decks made in China are on the same level as all of those awful Variflex and Nash boards that are now rotting in landfills across America. Trying to learn on a Variflex or a Nash would have been unthinkable many years ago, just as trying to learn on something like a Golden Dragon deck, or any other deck made in China, should be unthinkable for kids who are interested in learning how to skate.
I know this may sound like I’m an old man, but the problem is that the younger generation that are coming up now or have only started skating in the last 8 yrs will have never known the difference in quality between a USA made deck & a China/Mexico deck as most Co’s moved overseas a long time ago. You cant blame the kids in a way as China made is all they’ve grown up on hence why they dont understand.
I dont remember anyone breaking a deck other than when throwing themselves down stairs when they were made in USA, but now I see kids breaking decks from landing awkward on flat ground tricks, so there must be a weakness there somewhere in these Chinese decks.
I remember a friend of mine had a Variflex back when I started skating. I’d just upgraded from my 1st board (Transmissioms Pyromaniac piece of crap ha ha!) to a Powell McGill Skull & Snake. I jumped on his Variflex & it felt flat & cheap even tho Variflex were considered above low quality at the time
What Eddie is talking about is exactly what I’m fearing will happen. Too many kids will grow up getting used to stuff that is of totally crappy quality while paying top price as if wasn’t. There are still decks being made in the U.S., so there is still time to let kids know what is up with better quality American made decks vs. sub-par made in a sweatshop crap. Eddie is right, the kids shouldn’t be blamed. I think people who have been skating for awhile should let them know what is up instead, without being a complete dickhead, so they will hopefully make better decisions in the future.
So much to learn about economics….
All of the production industry of the US has been shipped overseas…we blame greedy corporations for this but in reality it is our government which has done this, and all in response to the petty cries of US citizens.
Unions, minimum wage, regulations, restrictions, taxes, and universal health care are all to blame. Why employ people in the US when you have to pay them OUTRAGEOUS prices to do a simple job. Look at the UAW…wayyy too much money for a simple operation.
So companies ship jobs overseas instead, book profits, and their owners (stockholders) are happy. But here’s the issue: normal middle class citizens are not booking these profits (at least, not in any large amounts). Therefore, all this attempted government regulation and control is the CAUSE of this issue, not the SOLUTION!
Every business regulation that is passed will ultimately destroy the middle class. The system is way too complex for a single person to understand (even Obama/Bush). They need to leave it alone before we have no manufacturing left.
Seeing that I am a working adult I would not be short $5.00 for the US made deck. Also, the sk8 companies that get their boards from China do not lower the price difference, they pocket it. I will take the US decks thank you. On the bottom of a pair of Indy’s it says “USA”, the day it says somewhere else I will be buying another truck. I have depended on quality equipment under my feet for over 35 years and it has always been there, I cannot accept anything less today.
I agree ‘b’. Dwindle dist moved their production to China way before anyone knew they were doing it. So before they were found to be producing in China they were charging FULL PRICE for those decks.
Then, when all was discovered they suddenly lowered the price of a deck onto the consumer claiming thats why they moved production to China despite pocketing $$$$’s before the truth came out.
Prices did remain lower for a while, but they are rising again so in the end it looks as though the consumer pays a little more now while the Co’s make more profit.
Might aswell have stayed in the US when you think about it.
I think theres a lot of counterfeit stuff out there too. I bought a set of Spitfire Leo Romero’s & they looked super wide for a 52mm wheel….
….that is unless DLX have moved their wheel production to Mexico aswell & not just their deck production
BUY LOCAL. BUY LOCAL MADE, if not THEN BUY USA.
Support what you got around you. Let your community flourish.
Plan B? Made in USA or China?
Dwindle decks use resin instead of wood glue, resin is more expensive than glue. That is why their decks cost the usual (around $50 give or take ), If their boards were pressed in the U.S. using resin they would probably cost sixty something dollars.
Dwindle sounds like a company to avoid. Their name probably says it all with the quality of their decks. Quality that dwindles. 50$ could buy one a U.S. made deck instead.
have recently just discovered that several companies including girl and chocolate have higher quality boards made in decent factories for their pro’s.the general public get the chinese crap.so what does that say about the quality?? and the integrity of these companies?..certain other companies have hinted at this going on in the industry in their ads i.e:REAL “the boards we make are the boards we ride” its no secret anymore that this is happening in the industry…so what do you think about your chinese made boards now??…obviously sponsored ams and pros dont wanna ride them.and you as a consumer are being ripped off with inferior product.
I will not buy a Chinese deck
I refuse to buy shitty chinese crap, and I’m not going to subject the people who come to my shop to that crap. I may not stock every trendy girl deck imaginable but everything people ride out of my shop is glorious. Period.
Re: Gino’s discovery.
I saw those Real ads a while ago & the thought passed thru my mind as to why they would mention “the boards we make are the boards we ride”.
I know that riders have been biggin up 1 product while actually riding another for some yrs (remember Koston riding for Royal but actually using Indy’s?), but if this is true then its even more of a kick in the teeth for us skateboarders. Why? Because we are PAYING for low quality crap that the Pro’s are supposed to be endorsing, while they refuse to ride them & instead get their higher quality decks for FREE!!
I rode a Girl deck about 14 yrs ago & it was pretty nice. I then rode a Chocolate deck (made in the same woodshop as Girl) about 3 yrs ago & it was heavy & had no pop. This shows that in that time period something bad happened, & that bad thing was that they moved production overseas to China.
…..BTW anyone know who presses/produces Blueprint decks as I heard it was PS Stix?
So are Flip decks made by PS Stix now?:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tG6X19oD07s&feature=related
The shops like Arnold’s are the ones that I am going to support.
I’m pretty sure that Blueprints are made in Mexico.
I am gutted. I just bought a Santa Cruz Flo ‘Lion Eyes’ deck in a sale, believing that SC made their decks in their own factory in the USA, but something doesnt seem right about this deck.
So are SC making some or all of their decks in China now, or am I just being paranoid?
i think all but three skateboard company’s have moved over sea’s powell made in u.s.a.
Alva is still made in the United States as is Beer City. Rebel Skates is from Portland, OR and makes everything in the United States. Powell-Peralta’s normal decks are made in the United States, but their Golden Dragon line isn’t. There is a company called Cohort that makes their decks in the United States. I haven’t tried any of their decks, but I might at some point. Zoo York makes their stuff in the USA. There’s still some more American made decks. One needs to do a bit of research though.
It seems that Birdhouse decks are made in the USA. I’m curious about Old Man Army decks and the new Hosoi decks. Old Man Army decks are made in the USA and hopefully the new Hosoi decks are too. Some sites are saying that Santa Cruz decks are now being made in China. That would be a shame since they were always good decks in the past.
Aww man I really miss Stereo, Popwar, Element, Bueno, AWS PS Stix USA made decks
.
Still cant find anything out there to replace that amazing pop